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Names of Portuguese M-frigates?

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  • Names of Portuguese M-frigates?

    Can any of the Portuguese forum-members tell us if the Portuguese navy has published the names for the M-frigates they bought?
    Today I heard the name for the first one (van Nes), but I wouldn't like to spoil anything by stating it here. That would be the privilege of the Portuguese navy and/or government, I guess.

  • #2
    Hi Rich

    I did not heard anything until today, the last time I asked I got the info the names were not yet choosen.

    Problem is that the PN operates in big secrecy, so for anything to come out is really dificult

    Btw
    Do you know when will the Van Nes arrive in Den Helder to start preparations?

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    • #3
      HNLMS Van Nes has finished her stint in the West Indies and is on her way back home. She will arrive shortly, to be decommisioned and start het maintenance period. Late 2008 she will be transferred to the Portuguese Navy.
      "Try and leave this world a little better than you found it" [Baden Powell]
      "Verbeter de wereld, begin bij jezelf"... [algemeen]
      ..."maar stop daarna niet en help ook een ander op weg!" [Paul Joosten]
      https://duurzamehuizenroute.nl/wonin...s-1905-veendam

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      • #4
        Thanks Paul!

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        • #5
          Van Nes en Van Galen. Beide fregatten worden op resp. 1 december 2008 en 1 november 2009 aan Portugal overgedragen. maar in welke volgorde ?? De nieuwe namen zijn nog niet bekend

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          • #6
            Stonewall: as a Portuguese what do you think the most likely name is for those 2 M-frigates?? And is it right to assume that the hull number will follow on to the Vasco Da Gama's??? That will be F333 for the Van Nes then, which is almost the same number as it has now (F833).

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            • #7
              Paul, both ships will not be decommissioned before the day of the transfer. Just like the Karel Doorman and the Willem van der Zaan they will remain commissioned untill that day.

              The van Nes will arrive in Den Helder on friday 14th december.

              As it looks now, according to the planning and wishes of the Portuguese navy, the transfer will take place at the end of november 2008 instead of in december. Personally I think that will prove to be a very tough date to meet with the extra work (modifications) that is requested by the Portuguese navy.

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              • #8
                "todg" wrote: Stonewall: as a Portuguese what do you think the most likely name is for those 2 M-frigates?? And is it right to assume that the hull number will follow on to the Vasco Da Gama's??? That will be F333 for the Van Nes then, which is almost the same number as it has now (F833).
                Names for Frigates are usually from Great Discovers (ex. Vasco da Gama Class) or High Officers of the Navy (Ex. Almirante Pereira da Silva class, named after Admirals and Comandante João Belo Class, named after Navy Commanders), so I expect one of both variants will be used.

                As for Pennants:

                the PN has allocated for it's warships the following sequences of NATO Pennant numbers:
                from F-470 until F-489
                from F-330 until F-336 (at least)
                F-330,331 and 332 are the Vasco da Gamas, so a logical sequence could be F333 and F334

                But there are also 2 pennants that are not used for a long time, F478 and F479, so I honestly do not know

                More recent numbers are/were (in increasing order)

                Frigates Pereira da Silva class: F472, 473,474
                João Coutinho Corvettes: F475,476,477,484,485, 471
                João Belo Frigates: F480,481,482,483
                Baptista de Andrade Corvettes: F486,487,488,489

                When the Vasco da Gama arrived the sequence was therefore changed back to F33x

                So I really do not know, maybe will only know when I see the pennant painted on the hull

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                • #9
                  "Rich" wrote: Paul, both ships will not be decommissioned before the day of the transfer. Just like the Karel Doorman and the Willem van der Zaan they will remain commissioned untill that day.

                  ...
                  But wasn't the Van der Zaan officially decomissioned? That news came out from the Navy Offcial Site and Dutch Defense Ministry site.... I remember that news, I have it somewhere...

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                  • #10
                    "Rich" wrote: Paul, both ships will not be decommissioned before the day of the transfer. Just like the Karel Doorman and the Willem van der Zaan they will remain commissioned untill that day.

                    The van Nes will arrive in Den Helder on friday 14th december.

                    As it looks now, according to the planning and wishes of the Portuguese navy, the transfer will take place at the end of november 2008 instead of in december. Personally I think that will prove to be a very tough date to meet with the extra work (modifications) that is requested by the Portuguese navy.

                    Rich I don't know where you got that information but below is a quote from the official RNLN website and look for the 29 November message of Van Nes:

                    "www.marine.nl/nieuws" wrote:
                    Stijlvolle afsluiting Goede Doel project Hr. Ms. Van Nes
                    29-11-2007


                    Hr. Ms. Van Nes heeft maandag 26 november haar goede doel project bij de scholengemeenschap Kolegio Chaya Willems afgesloten. De afsluiting viel samen met de weekopening van de school. De leerlingen en schoolleiding brachten tijdens deze gebeurtenis hun dank over aan de bemanning en het thuisfront van de Van Nes. LTZ Anne Moggré van de Goede Doel commissie: "Het was een indrukwekkende ceremonie met al die kinderen die ons toezongen!"


                    2007-11-29_stijlvolle_afsluiting_goede_doel_project_hrms_van_nes1.jpg



                    Tijdens haar periode als stationsschip heeft de Van Nes het Kolegio Chaya Willems geadopteerd en actief gesteund. Er is veel geld ingezameld, er zijn werkzaamheden op de school verricht, er is lesmateriaal en computers uit Nederland overgebracht en leerlingen van Chaya Willems hebben een tegenbezoek aan het schip gebracht. Het ingezamelde bedrag was ca. Euro 4500,- en is uitgegeven aan waterkoelers, bankjes voor op het schoolplein en enkele infrastructurele aanpassingen. Door deze activiteiten is een warme en hechte band ontstaan tussen de school en het schip.


                    2007-11-29_stijlvolle_afsluiting_goede_doel_project_hrms_van_nes2.jpg



                    Hr. Ms. Van Nes nadert inmiddels het einde van haar periode als stationsschip. Binnenkort zal zij terugkeren naar Nederland waar zij direct na aankomst uit dienst wordt gesteld. Komend jaar wordt het schip verkoopgereed gemaakt en zal eind 2008 worden overgedragen aan Portugal.

                    Als stationsschip heeft de Van Nes een actieve bijdrage geleverd aan de veiligheid rondom de Nederlandse Antillen en Aruba en elders in de Caribische regio. De meest in het oog springende inzet vond plaats afgelopen september. Na passage van de orkaan Felix heeft het schip noodhulp verleend in het getroffen gebied in Nicaragua. Daarnaast heeft het schip onlangs Kustwachttaken uitgevoerd nabij bovenwindse eilanden, waar haar aanwezigheid en scherpe controle van alle scheepvaart niet ongemerkt bleef. Verder heeft de Van Nes deelgenomen aan de bilaterale oefening VENHOL met Venezuela waarbij de banden met het buurland werden aangehaald.

                    Defensie is verantwoordelijk voor de verdediging van het Koninkrijk inclusief de Nederlandse Antillen en Aruba. De Koninklijke Marine geeft invulling aan deze taak middels een permanente aanwezigheid van mensen en materieel op de eilanden. Verder stationeert de Koninklijke Marine ieder half jaar een schip ter plaatse, het stationsschip. De taken van het stationsschip zijn:

                    Externe verdediging van de Nederlandse Antillen en Aruba, inclusief het onderhouden van relaties met de buurlanden ("vlagvertoon");
                    Uitvoeren van Kustwachttaken voor de Kustwacht van de Nederlandse Antillen en Aruba;
                    Leveren van noodhulp en militaire bijstand, zowel aan de landen van het Koninkrijk als elders in de regio;
                    Uitvoeren van internationale drugsbestrijdingsoperaties in de gehele Caribische regio onder Amerikaanse leiding.
                    "Try and leave this world a little better than you found it" [Baden Powell]
                    "Verbeter de wereld, begin bij jezelf"... [algemeen]
                    ..."maar stop daarna niet en help ook een ander op weg!" [Paul Joosten]
                    https://duurzamehuizenroute.nl/wonin...s-1905-veendam

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                    • #11
                      Can you translate that sentence in red, please....?




                      Rich, can you please check here:
                      http://www.dutchfleet.net/viewtopic.php?p=18573#18573

                      At the time it was officially anounced "decomissioning for Portugal" (1 or 2 days after corrected to Belgium, I remember at the time the Navy Site said Portugal and the Defense Ministry said Belgium , or vice-versa, I have print-screens of both but I still have not find them...)

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                      • #12
                        "Stonewall" wrote: Can you translate that sentence in red, please....?

                        My pleasure: "In a short while she (HNLMS Van Nes) will return to The Netherlands where immediately upon arrival she will be decommissioned."
                        "Try and leave this world a little better than you found it" [Baden Powell]
                        "Verbeter de wereld, begin bij jezelf"... [algemeen]
                        ..."maar stop daarna niet en help ook een ander op weg!" [Paul Joosten]
                        https://duurzamehuizenroute.nl/wonin...s-1905-veendam

                        Reactie


                        • #13
                          Friday HNLMS Van Nes arrives at 141207 Den Helder .........Hr.Ms. Van Nes VTA Den Helder


                          --
                          HNLMS Van Nes F-833.jpg

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                          • #14
                            Paul & Stonewall,
                            Sure I can tell you how I know the van Nes will not be and the Zaan has not been decommissioned. Except for the Karel Doorman I worked, work or will work on all of these M-frigates that have been sold.

                            The first ship that was sold, the Abraham van der Hulst (now Almirante Blanco Encalada) was decommissioned and sold long after that happened. Recommissioned in the RNLN at the end of it's maintenance period and again decommissioned on the day of transfer to the Chilean Navy (dec 15, 2005).

                            The second M-frigate, the Tjerk Hiddes (now Almirante Riveros) was officially decommissioned in feb 2006. In that period a large Dutch tourist company (forgot the name) was entangled in a very long going lawsuit about a lot of money. This Dutch firm was undertaking steps to seize all Chilean property and funds in the Netherlands to gain some leverage in the lawsuit. The Dutch navy did not want to get involved in this matter, so to make it clear to everyone that the Tjerk Hiddes was still Dutch property she was silently recommissioned! No ceremony, just the RNLN project officer who gave the RNLN duty-officer on the Hiddes the order to raise the war-pennant again. How I know? I was the duty-officer that day :-D .

                            The reason why we used to decommission these kind of ships was just for administrative reasons. RNLN ships have a UKC (for the outsiders: kind of budget reference number) to which all costs of operation are accounted. After decommissioning these ships would get a new UKC to make the bookkeeping easy. After the Hiddes that procedure was deemed to be unnecessary. Instead of decommissioning, a date was chosen to just switch UKC's. This simplified procedure also takes care of other legal issues.

                            Paul, as a fellow RNLN-officer you know as well as I do that the people that maintain our RNLN site also make mistakes so I wouldn't count on them as the most reliable source. There's so much going on that they can't possibly update everything on time.
                            On 20 december 2007 command of the van Nes will be transferred from KLTZ Sillevis-Smit to KTZ Wijbrands. Directly after that the van Nes will move to the naval dockyard to commence her maintenance period. The van Nes will not be decommissioned.

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                            • #15
                              Dear Rich

                              Thanks a lot for your clarifications on the matter :D

                              Always good to get information from people who really knows what they are talking about


                              Please take good care of Her (Van Nes)

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